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didvenusblowyourmindI'm going to preface this by saying that it is my personal opinion and is not about anyone on my flist.
That being said:
Cheating. I. Don't. Get. It.
Someone explain it to me. When is it okay to cheat? What makes anyone think this is acceptable? Or, on the flip side, what makes a person say this is wrong but I'm doing it anyway.
Now, I am not presuming there are hard and fast rules. I am not presuming all situations are the same. I am not speaking of mutually agreed upon open relationships. Nor am I even really speaking of one-time flings, because people fuck up. I am talking about repeated cheating. When you cheat, and then you go back for more. And I am talking about enablers.
Now, I do not classify those who help as equally as guilty as those who are cheating, because in the end it is your responsibilty as the one in the relationship to make that choice to cheat or not. However, knowingly helping someone cheat is shitty.
What makes people cheat? I haven't been there, so I can't say. But I have always felt that, unless there was a reason I couldn't get out, unless I felt threatened, I would rather leave than cheat. Because it is absolutely and positively unfair to cheat on someone in order to see if things work with someone else or because you're horny or drunk or anything. The idea that they didn't want to fuck up a relationship over a one-night stand they really wanted is ridiculous. No one said relationships are easy. No one said you won't be attracted to someone else and be tempted. I am not talking about temptation. I am talking about making that leap, and breaking your commitment. Being drunk is not an excuse. I have been drunk off my ass. I have never not had the capacity to decide whether or not to sleep with someone or to not know if it was okay or not. If you are actually so drunk that it takes away your ability to decide, then you have a PROBLEM and need to call AA. Cheating is just crappy. It's a lame excuse and an easy way out. I don't care how often you want to say it's really difficult and it makes you feel bad and you wish things could be different blah blah blah. You have a fucking choice and you make that choice, and if you want to run around on someone, that's your choice but karma is a bitch and you will get exactly what is coming to you.
And helping someone to cheat ... is shitty. It's really fucking shitty. He's unhappy in a relationship, he's going to leave his wife ... those are lousy excuses. And that's exactly what they are. They're excuses to make yourself feel better about doing something crappy. I'm not talking about not knowing someone was involved. I am talking about the fact that some asshole came to you wanting to cheat, and you willingly helped him make someone else into a fool. A cheater will cheat. He'll go somewhere else and do it without you. (Oh, you didn't realize that? Sorry. You aren't special. You're means to an end.) But that doesn't mean YOU need to help. Helping someone to cheat is being an enabler, and that's just crappy, regardless of what lies he feeds you. Because, guess what: he's not going to leave her. You aren't different. You're the piece of ass on the side, nothing more and nothing less. And even if you are, by some off chance, more than that ... what in the world makes you think you'll be any different? Because once upon a time, she was more too. Your time will be up, and you'll just be part of the cycle. I cannot even believe the number of people who get all upset when their relationship sucks when they're the other woman! Do those words have no meaning? Other, as in secondary, as in afterthought.
And yes, I've been an enabler. I was fifteen, and it's not something I would ever do now. Even then, it was a shitty thing to do and I feel shitty about it. And it's exactly as I said it was -- fucking nothing, and shitty.
But I guess it will always go on. In the meantime, I'm interested to hear your thoughts -- is cheating okay? Under certain circumstances? When? Why? Why not?
That being said:
Cheating. I. Don't. Get. It.
Someone explain it to me. When is it okay to cheat? What makes anyone think this is acceptable? Or, on the flip side, what makes a person say this is wrong but I'm doing it anyway.
Now, I am not presuming there are hard and fast rules. I am not presuming all situations are the same. I am not speaking of mutually agreed upon open relationships. Nor am I even really speaking of one-time flings, because people fuck up. I am talking about repeated cheating. When you cheat, and then you go back for more. And I am talking about enablers.
Now, I do not classify those who help as equally as guilty as those who are cheating, because in the end it is your responsibilty as the one in the relationship to make that choice to cheat or not. However, knowingly helping someone cheat is shitty.
What makes people cheat? I haven't been there, so I can't say. But I have always felt that, unless there was a reason I couldn't get out, unless I felt threatened, I would rather leave than cheat. Because it is absolutely and positively unfair to cheat on someone in order to see if things work with someone else or because you're horny or drunk or anything. The idea that they didn't want to fuck up a relationship over a one-night stand they really wanted is ridiculous. No one said relationships are easy. No one said you won't be attracted to someone else and be tempted. I am not talking about temptation. I am talking about making that leap, and breaking your commitment. Being drunk is not an excuse. I have been drunk off my ass. I have never not had the capacity to decide whether or not to sleep with someone or to not know if it was okay or not. If you are actually so drunk that it takes away your ability to decide, then you have a PROBLEM and need to call AA. Cheating is just crappy. It's a lame excuse and an easy way out. I don't care how often you want to say it's really difficult and it makes you feel bad and you wish things could be different blah blah blah. You have a fucking choice and you make that choice, and if you want to run around on someone, that's your choice but karma is a bitch and you will get exactly what is coming to you.
And helping someone to cheat ... is shitty. It's really fucking shitty. He's unhappy in a relationship, he's going to leave his wife ... those are lousy excuses. And that's exactly what they are. They're excuses to make yourself feel better about doing something crappy. I'm not talking about not knowing someone was involved. I am talking about the fact that some asshole came to you wanting to cheat, and you willingly helped him make someone else into a fool. A cheater will cheat. He'll go somewhere else and do it without you. (Oh, you didn't realize that? Sorry. You aren't special. You're means to an end.) But that doesn't mean YOU need to help. Helping someone to cheat is being an enabler, and that's just crappy, regardless of what lies he feeds you. Because, guess what: he's not going to leave her. You aren't different. You're the piece of ass on the side, nothing more and nothing less. And even if you are, by some off chance, more than that ... what in the world makes you think you'll be any different? Because once upon a time, she was more too. Your time will be up, and you'll just be part of the cycle. I cannot even believe the number of people who get all upset when their relationship sucks when they're the other woman! Do those words have no meaning? Other, as in secondary, as in afterthought.
And yes, I've been an enabler. I was fifteen, and it's not something I would ever do now. Even then, it was a shitty thing to do and I feel shitty about it. And it's exactly as I said it was -- fucking nothing, and shitty.
But I guess it will always go on. In the meantime, I'm interested to hear your thoughts -- is cheating okay? Under certain circumstances? When? Why? Why not?
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no subject
Date: 2006-09-18 03:49 am (UTC)My own definition is still murky, I guess. Mostly it has to do with each individual relationship and how the two parties in it view said relationship. In one partnership, it may get to the point where thinking of him dancing sexy or flirting to extreme measures with another girl would turn my stomach, and while I wouldn't consider it anything like kissing or sleeping with another girl, I would consider it cheating to a lesser degree. In another partnership, maybe we're just not as committed, seeing each other more casually, and even kissing other girls is fine. (Although, lol, I don't think I've ever been in a relationship where I've felt comfortable with that thought.)
I don't know why people cheat - boredom? feeling trapped? feeling overwhelmingly curious or attracted to someone? I've never been one to cheat, so I honestly don't know. I don't think drunkenness is a good excuse, though I have had friends who've been so drunk they didn't even remember having sex. I think if the desire to get out is strong enough, or maybe they're not getting enough attention in the relationship, they dread the painfulness and questioning of a breakup and instead try to simply "add excitement."
I wouldn't say the enabler is as much to blame as the cheater, though; I think that's a bit unfair, as they didn't have the responsibility to the relationship. I think they should respect the person and their relationship, but everyone sees things differently. Perhaps they just wanted to help a friend who's unhappy. Perhaps... I don't know... maybe they do think they can change things. I honestly don't know.
Basically, I do believe in loyalty and responsibility to a relationship. I think that if chosen to commit seriously, I should be for him only - no leading guys on, kissing, anything that would make me feel guilty, basically. And I would expect the same from him. However, I would think even just a little more important to me would be honesty. I've always heard that the best couples admit to their crushes, admit to temptations, because it's out there - it's honest. And that's what I would want just a little bit more.
Can I ask what prompted this discussion? I'm curious to hear everyone's responses!
no subject
Date: 2006-09-18 04:00 am (UTC)That being said, I completely agree that it depends on what is acceptable within each person's relationship -- which is why it doesn't bother me at all if people have completely open relationships and want to sleep with other people. That's not for me, but if people don't want monogamy, as long as they've both agreed upon this, then I don't see who it hurts. It's more the idea that one person thinks they have one thing ... and the other person knows this, and is going behind their back anyway.
I don't think the enabler is as much to blame. Definitely not. The person in the relationship is the one responsible for making that decision. I don't think an enabler is to blame at all if they didn't even realize. That being said, if they did realize, and kept doing it, it's still crappy, in my opinion. Not as crappy as being the cheater, but it's still willingly helping to hurt someone else.
As for temptations and honesty ... I agree. I don't think there's anything wrong or unnatural with temptation. It's acting on it. If the temptation becomes so great that someoe feels they just HAVE to act on it, then maybe they need to reevaluate the relationship they're already in. Honesty is always the best policy, though, I think -- I would be much more likely to forgive someone who cheated once and confessed than someone who didn't admit to it. I know people make mistakes, and I can even see cheating once as a mistake. It's repeatedly doing it ... that shows an active plan to do it, or that they are blantantly ignoring the consequences.